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Post by yellowshark on Jul 1, 2008 11:57:19 GMT
I've just ordered a 13.5, I'm not going through another race well down on pace, I've run out of toys to throw out my pram. Yes we've proved that 13.5 are not equivalent to 27T on our track anyway, but lets remember that young Craig was racing with a Brushed stock motor at the STCC at the weekend and more than held his own, infact until he went off in his last Heat he was up for qualifying for the A final. Col That surely is a if not the key point here Col. Craig is running brushed because a) he still has things to learn and do better b) he is still improving his times c) Dad can't afford it. Running brushed is not going to make one a better driver and make you go faster. If you can't get 100% out of your 27T ie it is too powerful for you (which of the regulars just about includes evryone bar Mark,Les Rob, Dan and Staples) then going for something more powerful will just add to your woes. Everybody knew 13.5 was not equiavalent. The BRCA and BTCC went with 27T. The STCC, always pushing the boundariwes only went with brushed after considerable discussion. The SLCC went with brushed. Importantly SHMCC went with brushed. So let's enjoy our season, let the committe do their research and then discuss some facts, experience and considered judgements at the apporpriate time, ie AGM |
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Post by yellowshark on Jul 1, 2008 11:59:07 GMT
... that should of course have said STTC going brushless  |
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Post by Robin Howett on Jul 1, 2008 12:04:49 GMT
Pete, the problem is we have a great set of new racers all just getting into racing and if we can encourage them along with out the pain of running brushed motors all the better for them and the club.
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Post by yellowshark on Jul 1, 2008 12:53:06 GMT
Yup agree absoulutely Rob (in my defence refer my ealrier posts above) ; I think unfortunately the thread got twisted away from 17.5 to include 13.5.
Just picked up today a Checkpoint plus a whole host of the CP8808 race brushes for less than £20!!!. Boy the cost of brushed racing has plummeted in recent months. Going back to get a stack of real cheap Reedy 767s for the Axioms ;D
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Post by Mark Townsend on Jul 1, 2008 14:36:07 GMT
I agree Pete, decisions are made at the AGM regarding the forthcoming years rules. I think this year is going to be a bit of an exception because of the rapid introduction and development of the dreaded brushless systems.
More and more people seem to be trying brushless systems for stock equivalence and I think the committee will want to discuss their findings. I wouldn't advise anyone rush out to buy a 17.5 system until the people who organise the club have made a decision.
I know the Ians and Les have tried 17.5 and managed 18 laps. Good stock motors are capable of 19 laps and a good stock with a good driver makes 20 laps.
I don't think it's a knee jerk reaction but a response to peoples requirements. While we'd never turn racers away we must try and accomodate their needs.
For example we have the facility to run full blown modified races if enough racers turn up. They don't anymore, but we wouldn't turn them away.
I think the same logic should be applied to these 17.5 motors. I haven't seen a speed advantage to them and I think for a beginner class or for those that want zero maintenance they would be ideal. I also think they'd sit in with stock 27BR quite happily and provide some excellent races. Should the need arise we can separate the BL motors into their own class and still retain 27BR but it's numbers dependant.
Trouble is Pete if everyone wants to run 17.5 and we don't allow them where will they go?
Lets leave it with the committee to make their informed decision based on what's been said here and trackside, then support them to keep our club the best around.
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Post by yellowshark on Jul 1, 2008 16:52:00 GMT
Mark, I agree with everything you say. Perhaps I did not articulate my point very clearly. My "knee jerk" reference was meant to be about people dashing off and taking action without allowing the committee (with whom we have vested the governance of our club) to consider and discuss and either make some decisions if possible or provide guidance if possible.
I say "if possible" because I consider the committee to be in a pretty invidious position right now. The UK (at regional level) and the USA have taken different positions, whilst the BRCA have stayed with 27T.
So yes let us let the committee deliberate and abide by their conclusions. Mind you if Les made 18 laps they sound a bit faster than 27T to me ;D
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Post by number1dan on Jul 1, 2008 19:14:46 GMT
hello gentleman,
Is there any chance of any jobs anyone wants me to do for relatively minimum wage because I'm trying to raise money to buy a brushless system, be it washing your car or a bribe to let you win a race lol, or anything really, let me know if there is anything you want me to do ;D . How was my english Keith?
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Post by yellowshark on Jul 1, 2008 19:46:08 GMT
hello gentleman, Is there any chance of any jobs anyone wants me to do for relatively minimum wage because I'm trying to raise money to buy a brushless system, be it washing your car or a bribe to let you win a race lol, or anything really, let me know if there is anything you want me to do ;D . How was my english Keith? I've got some brushes that need re-facing Dan  Oh, the language was looking good; need to be careful with your indefinite articles but you were on for an A final Dan until the question  |
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Post by keitheroonie on Jul 1, 2008 21:37:03 GMT
I've just ordered a 13.5, I'm not going through another race well down on pace, I've run out of toys to throw out my pram. Yes we've proved that 13.5 are not equivalent to 27T on our track anyway, but lets remember that young Craig was racing with a Brushed stock motor at the STCC at the weekend and more than held his own, infact until he went off in his last Heat he was up for qualifying for the A final. Col A very valid point, unfortunately I'm never likely to get to the level Craig is now, even with a 13.5 brushless he is still sure to beat me. But as Pete said in a previous post, I can always turn down the top end speed on my transmitter, this should give me lots of punch out of corners but a top end comparable to the 27t. I can also adjust the other way, with less punch and more top end, simply by adjusting the throttle speed. If Craig had been running a 13.5 at the STCC, I'm sure he would have made the A final (maybe even a podium finish), as he would have had the power and pace to make up for the time he spent on the grass. Don't get me wrong 13.5 is not the way to go in stock, more entry level pro stock in my opinion, which is what I'll use mine for when I fancy a change of pace. I'm not in it to win it but just to have fun  it doesn't frustrate me when I'm to blame for bad lap times, as I never expect that much from myself when I'm racing anyway, however if I'm so down on pace that I'm forever moving out of the way of other drivers, I do get frustrated and that starts to take the fun out of it. I'm sure after I spend more time waiting for marshals to put my car back on the track than driving, I'll probably be posting about how going brushless is a bad idea ;D |
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Post by number1dan on Jul 2, 2008 19:18:08 GMT
how much would a gd brushless system cost including 2 motors
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Post by number1dan on Jul 2, 2008 19:29:52 GMT
i found a nosram speedo nr91830 and a nosram storm 10.5 for £245 is that gd
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Post by Reuben on Jul 2, 2008 21:40:30 GMT
well... i was looking at the speed passion. 17.5 brushless = $79 13.5 & Speed passion GT speedo = $252 brushless wire set = $14 postage = $17 total price converted to GBP = £185 all in. get it sent as a gift to escape import and VAT tax and thats it for the full sha-bang www.speedtechrc.com/store/ebproduct.asp?catmainid=646 |
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Post by Mark Townsend on Jul 2, 2008 22:19:25 GMT
Yep Speedtech is the place to go. But get the LRP Sphere TC speedo and a 10.5 Novak. Delivered for about £165. If you want an extra motor they're £40
All wires included in the Sphere so you don't need a wire set.
With this set up I made 20 303 tonight and the car was flying. Ready to take on the Cotswolds now!
Mark
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Post by lesbaldry on Jul 3, 2008 10:05:03 GMT
[quote author=yellowshark board=general thread=129 po
So yes let us let the committee deliberate and abide by their conclusions. Mind you if Les made 18 laps they sound a bit faster than 27T to me ;D[/quote]
No Pete they are proving to be slightly slower at the moment,the night the 17.5 was tested the grip was "odd" and most lads lap times were down!...nomally I run a slow 19 lap with stock and have been known to pop a 20 lap in with an exceptionaly good "tweaked 27t,Its early days yet and prehaps a fiddle with FDRs and speedos the 17.5 will be a good motor!!but the idear of the 17.5 is to have a "agro" free motor to have fun with on club days!!....As i put in previous posts the only real way to find out about the 17.5 is to run them in race conditions...Bushed motors are dying fast!!
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Post by Robin Howett on Jul 3, 2008 11:38:53 GMT
well... i was looking at the speed passion. 17.5 brushless = $79 13.5 & Speed passion GT speedo = $252 brushless wire set = $14 postage = $17 total price converted to GBP = £185 all in. get it sent as a gift to escape import and VAT tax and thats it for the full sha-bang www.speedtechrc.com/store/ebproduct.asp?catmainid=646The LRP/ nosram is the current speedo of choice (this will change no doubt) so if your buying thsi is the way to go. |
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Post by yellowshark on Jul 3, 2008 13:59:57 GMT
Oh no Les, my wit was wasted  I can only assume you are having a great holiday, are relaxed and not up to rapier thrust of the subtleties at the moment ;D |
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Post by ukcmf on Jul 4, 2008 9:26:35 GMT
.Bushed motors are dying fast!! Unless its wet or damp and then you use brushless at your peril.....and we do live in the UK. Col |
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Post by yellowshark on Jul 4, 2008 10:00:15 GMT
.Bushed motors are dying fast!! Unless its wet or damp and then you use brushless at your peril.....and we do live in the UK. Col Well I hope our new Checkpoint factory spec motor doesn't die too soon Mind you it does say that it contains lead, which in the state of California is known to cause reproductive harm. Just as well we live in Dorset then ;D |
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Post by Mark Townsend on Jul 4, 2008 10:09:31 GMT
That explains Californians as well then!
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Post by saintroeer on Jul 4, 2008 10:25:05 GMT
you cant explain californians, you can barely understand them,even the few that speak english!
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Post by yellowshark on Jul 4, 2008 11:42:18 GMT
you cant explain californians, you can barely understand them,even the few that speak english! Maybe but looking at the girls on my surfin' movies I think I could probably put up with that ;D |
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Post by lesbaldry on Jul 4, 2008 13:20:54 GMT
you cant explain californians, you can barely understand them,even the few that speak english! Maybe but looking at the girls on my surfin' movies I think I could probably put up with that ;D "Girls in surfing movies"...you need to be where I am at the moment.."see them for real"....It's a awfull job to walk the dog on the beach without getting a sore neck... ..I have to wear realy dark shade's so the missus dont catch me gawking!! |
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Post by lesbaldry on Jul 4, 2008 13:38:23 GMT
Oh no Les, my wit was wasted I can only assume you are having a great holiday, are relaxed and not up to rapier thrust of the subtleties at the moment ;D Yep,ok Pete ,sorry I missed the thrust....had limited time on a mates lap top and was reading between the lines ....Lets hope the weathers good for the Cotwolds...see you lot later "I hope?" Adam Ian and I are camping but I forgot to pack the small tent but dont worry there's space in the "out house" as long as you dont snore" at either end !!!";D |
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Post by saintroeer on Jul 4, 2008 13:59:17 GMT
Adam Ian and I are camping but I forgot to pack the small tent but dont worry there's space in the "out house" as long as you dont snore" at either end !!!";D[/quote]
Just picked up a tent so not worried about that, just trying to get hold of ian so as to see when we are traveling and whether i need to bring some food and drink or we will get it when we get there.
two days to get over jet-lag and prepare a car is not the way to go me thinks!
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Custard
Hitting the Tyre
http://pomegranate.ltd.uk/+
Posts: 32
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Post by Custard on Jul 5, 2008 11:02:42 GMT
Sorry to stick my 2p'th in to an already complicated thread, but.. If you want to compare motors, then you need to use a different metric to compare them with. Using 'turns' is obviously very variable and the motors performance is altered depending on other factors such as wire guage, magnets, construction etc.. Maybe you could compare using power in Watts, Horsepower, Torque, RPM. These stats are available from motor manufacturers. After all, this is how real cars are compared. Using turns is like comparing a 2 litre carburettor engine with a 2 litre turbo. No comparison really. Has anyone (BRCA etc) done this comparison? ( I made a bit of a start here custard.demon.co.uk/twiki/bin/view/Custard/RcMotors but need some more specs and time to progress with it ) B |
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it doesn't frustrate me when I'm to blame for bad lap times, as I never expect that much from myself when I'm racing anyway, however if I'm so down on pace that I'm forever moving out of the way of other drivers, I do get frustrated and that starts to take the fun out of it.
I can only assume you are having a great holiday, are relaxed and not up to rapier thrust of the subtleties at the moment ;D
