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Post by Reuben on Jun 26, 2008 14:01:44 GMT
so im interested in getting a new chassis, one built more for race rather than designed to bash arround the street. 2 cars that have been sofar suggested are a pro 4 or the Cyclone. the Cyclone is the 2006 Worlds Edition www.hbeurope.com/kit.php?partNo=66450&lang=en£210 from mirage, The pro 4 will be cheaper and second hand, so has had a decent setup. and im not to bothered about it being second hand, so thats nothing to decide on  im looking for a decent car that i will be able to setup to run at a comfortable speed, aswell as being able to go smoother and faster as i improve in ability. just for peoples opinions, what would they suggest and why? |
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Post by Mark Townsend on Jun 26, 2008 14:49:36 GMT
Choosing between the two, i'd go for the Cyclone. Belt drive, current model plenty of support from other drivers round the pits. It has just been superceded by the Cyclone TC which has a few changes but costs another £60 ish.
The downside to the Pro4 is the shaft drive. It generates a lot of torque steer due to motor position. The car will attempt to twist left to right when you apply power. It can be a problem coming out of corners. Also very few people run them anymore so spares are becoming rarer, especially the bevel gears that strip all too easily.
Me being a massive fan of Tamiya stuff and just bought the TRF416 I would always say Tamiya.
Mark
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Post by ukcmf on Jun 26, 2008 14:56:03 GMT
so im interested in getting a new chassis, one built more for race rather than designed to bash arround the street. 2 cars that have been sofar suggested are a pro 4 or the Cyclone. the Cyclone is the 2006 Worlds Edition www.hbeurope.com/kit.php?partNo=66450&lang=en£210 from mirage, The pro 4 will be cheaper and second hand, so has had a decent setup. and im not to bothered about it being second hand, so thats nothing to decide on im looking for a decent car that i will be able to setup to run at a comfortable speed, aswell as being able to go smoother and faster as i improve in ability. just for peoples opinions, what would they suggest and why? Reuban, The Pro 4 i shaft drive the ther is a belt drive, Dan advanced hugely when he moved from his pro4 to the cyclone WCE, if you buy the Pro4 in a couple of months you'll out grow it and need to buy the cyclone anyway. If you buy new and build it yourself you know all the parts are there and its built well, with the second hand car you just never know. The cyclone is straightforward to build and comes with great instructions unlike Matts Scythe. You can use most of the pro4 parts as spare for the cyclone. Several people at the club have cyclones and so the advice knowledge and spares are there. There is a third option the new Cyclone TC....you can get it from the US (Speedtech RC) for about the same as the WCE cyclone. Dunno if that helps, but Dan & Derek will be at Bashley Sat & Sun if you want a look at both cars 'in the flesh' (Pro4 & WCE Cyclone) and a chat. Col |
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Post by ukcmf on Jun 26, 2008 15:32:09 GMT
Choosing between the two, i'd go for the Cyclone. Belt drive, current model plenty of support from other drivers round the pits. It has just been superceded by the Cyclone TC which has a few changes but costs another £60 ish. The downside to the Pro4 is the shaft drive. It generates a lot of torque steer due to motor position. The car will attempt to twist left to right when you apply power. It can be a problem coming out of corners. Also very few people run them anymore so spares are becoming rarer, especially the bevel gears that strip all too easily. Me being a massive fan of Tamiya stuff and just bought the TRF416 I would always say Tamiya. Mark Two probs with that...... 1 - Tamiyas are BLUE 2 - Im sure you're the only person keeping them in business....and how many Tamiyas do you have.....even Wendy wasnt sure  |
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Post by Simon Crabb on Jun 26, 2008 15:54:55 GMT
I know what I'd buy, a Tamiya!
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Post by ukcmf on Jun 26, 2008 16:13:00 GMT
I know what I'd buy, a Tamiya! Boo hiss...dont listen Reuban Si only drives minis and a crawler these days oh yeah and a camper van so unless you want to go slooooowwww |
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Post by lesbaldry on Jun 26, 2008 16:43:24 GMT
If an up together Pro 4 with a pile of spares to last a life time can be brought for £60/70 to last Reuben till next season and bearing in mind he's young and just started work,I think its a posible choice...as for growing out of it quickly...no chance!!...its still a good car,very stable and once a title winning car... beter than what he's running now!!
Ps the mentioned car/s are Owens and they will probably come with some radio gear too thats worth that amount.but if one can afford £200/250 plus decent radio gear, for a new chassis to learn on then go for it!
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Post by ukcmf on Jun 26, 2008 17:59:06 GMT
Reuban,
If the Pro4 is Owens then you wont have any worrys, so i guess its just up to how much you can afford to spend at this time and whether you want to future proof yourself. But if you buy the Pro4 you will be able to use it/sell it for spares if you decide to move on.
Col
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Post by saintroeer on Jun 26, 2008 18:42:37 GMT
or instead of selling you can upgrade to a cyclone WE and have a ready made spares kit - thanks derek!
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Post by saintroeer on Jun 26, 2008 18:43:23 GMT
I know what I'd buy, a Tamiya! blue sucks! |
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Post by Mark Townsend on Jun 26, 2008 19:15:29 GMT
Taking into account the cost the Pro 4 seems a reasonable bet, but it will always have uneven steering left to right and the gearboxes do have a tendancy to strip bevel gears. I know, I had one. Another option would be the Cyclone S and then upgrade as and when funds allow.
These questions as to which is better option A or option B usually involve 50 people with 50 different answers. There are currently a lot of high spec, well built cars out there and none of them are dogs. For me it comes down to things like parts support, help with set ups and ease of maintenance.
Just don't buy anything based on the colour purple!
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Post by Reuben on Jun 26, 2008 19:20:08 GMT
thanks for all the opinions. as far as im aware they are both purple and purple rules anyway. i think atm im leaning towards the pro 4, purely because it will come with spares and will have decent parts already on it from an ex-racer. Plus the lower cost is always an incentive. also it would be a shame to have a car waste away in someones garage. |
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Post by number1dan on Jun 26, 2008 20:37:40 GMT
well reuben,
i had a pro 4 for quite a while and i think my personal best was 18/302 or summin like that so its quite a capable car and dont let this torque steer business deter you because in 27T u cant notice it that much,
however the cyclone is an incredible car and extremely reliable and could potentially get 20 laps in 27T. and the price thing is an issue so its down to what u wanna do, but i would suggest the cyclone as then u would like neva hav to get a new car so the cyclone would become "YOUR" car and eventually u would no it inside out back to front and setup wouldnt be so much of an issue anymore
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Post by yellowshark on Jun 26, 2008 21:51:11 GMT
Well Reuben if you can stretch to 280 and want engineering excellence, gold class build quality, diffs that last forever, shocks that don’t leak, drive shafts that don’t break if you breathe on them, global race success, huge spares availability, designed for Lipo and brushless technologies, a perfect setup for Bashley straight out of the box, everything thing you need to be super competitive without the hidden cost of a myriad of hop-ups missing from the base kit, then there IS only once choice, and it hasn’t been mentioned yet |
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Post by Reuben on Jun 26, 2008 22:32:43 GMT
Well Reuben if you can stretch to 280 and want engineering excellence, gold class build quality, diffs that last forever, shocks that don’t leak, drive shafts that don’t break if you breathe on them, global race success, huge spares availability, designed for Lipo and brushless technologies, a perfect setup for Bashley straight out of the box, everything thing you need to be super competitive without the hidden cost of a myriad of hop-ups missing from the base kit, then there IS only once choice, and it hasn’t been mentioned yet ever thought of working in advertising? because thats not a bad sales pitch. but as you said it still hasnt been mentioned yet and without mentioning it, we (I) may never know. well i have a few weeks to think about it, until i know more about the pro 4. + it gives me some time to save some cash so i dont feel bad explaining to girlfriend that i just spent £££ on a car instead of a holiday deposit lol |
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Post by ukcmf on Jun 27, 2008 5:48:02 GMT
Well Reuben if you can stretch to 280 and want engineering excellence, gold class build quality, diffs that last forever, shocks that don’t leak, drive shafts that don’t break if you breathe on them, global race success, huge spares availability, designed for Lipo and brushless technologies, a perfect setup for Bashley straight out of the box, everything thing you need to be super competitive without the hidden cost of a myriad of hop-ups missing from the base kit, then there IS only once choice, and it hasn’t been mentioned yet So why arent you using it then Pete ;D ::::runs:::: Col |
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Post by ukcmf on Jun 27, 2008 5:54:51 GMT
u would like neva hav to get a new car Ahhh Ha....Am saving this bit for future reference...just in case someone decides they neeeeeeeeeeeed a new car |
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Post by yellowshark on Jun 27, 2008 6:28:42 GMT
Well Reuben if you can stretch to 280 and want engineering excellence, gold class build quality, diffs that last forever, shocks that don’t leak, drive shafts that don’t break if you breathe on them, global race success, huge spares availability, designed for Lipo and brushless technologies, a perfect setup for Bashley straight out of the box, everything thing you need to be super competitive without the hidden cost of a myriad of hop-ups missing from the base kit, then there IS only once choice, and it hasn’t been mentioned yet So why arent you using it then Pete ;D ::::runs:::: Col LOL Nice one Col; especially given the unearthly hour  |
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Post by ukcmf on Jun 27, 2008 7:03:30 GMT
So why arent you using it then Pete ;D ::::runs:::: Col LOL Nice one Col; especially given the unearthly hour Hey some of us have been at work for an hour  |
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Post by lesbaldry on Jun 27, 2008 7:15:38 GMT
Just a thought Col...Is Derek going to use the Cyclone chassis I gave him??....Just had another thought ..I forgot ,Owen has a Cyclone too...Unfortunatly Im on my hols for two week and wont see Owen "and he's working in Devon"....Dont worry Reuben between us lot WE will find you a good car to learn with without the stupid expence...somthing you can "bang about with" with out hurting your pocket??....Dont worry about "torque steer"should you get a Pro 4,as Dan said you will hardly notice it with stock ,besides shaft drive cars accelerate faster out of corners and off the line ;D...my advise would be to learn with somthing good but cheep untill you become consitant ,then buy your self a "shiney new toy"...wait till the new year ??
Blue do'es suck?!?!?
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Post by yellowshark on Jun 27, 2008 8:40:20 GMT
LOL Nice one Col; especially given the unearthly hour Hey some of us have been at work for an hour Ah so posting at 5:36am yesterday would be classified as work then Col ;D |
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Post by Mark Townsend on Jun 27, 2008 9:12:52 GMT
Is that with all the free upgrades the company had to send out to make up for the poor quality kits Pete? And are you running the ultra thin pinions and spurs to avoid them grinding away your cells? Don't get that problem with a blue car. And what colour is this fantastic machine? |
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Post by yellowshark on Jun 27, 2008 10:11:12 GMT
Is that with all the free upgrades the company had to send out to make up for the poor quality kits Pete? And are you running the ultra thin pinions and spurs to avoid them grinding away your cells? Don't get that problem with a blue car. And what colour is this fantastic machine? Alright I have taken the bait  I run Lipos so I never had the problem anyway ;D, BUT. All design ultimately creates compromises. The chassis's superior balance comes from several design factors including moving the engine in-board absoluteley as far as possible, which gives a very tight tolerance against the 6 cell pack. But you DO NOTneed the new spurs/pinions , you just need to use a bit of nouse and bash the rearmost battery connector in slighly IF it is fouling. It really didn't need a few pr*ts on the forum raising hell when their packs were poorly put together and it was easy to fix. The big issue was the front belt on the EU version, IR of 2.375 vs the USA 1.7. Yes you would rightly question how on earth that got through QA, especially when you look at the awsome facilites they have for design and testing. But it did, no excuses there. (The phrase "poor quality kit" is in danger of being very misleading.  >:(The quality of the kit is of the highest order, as is the build documentation, build experience and setup and tuning documentation. This one car had been designed and engineered to suite the variations of racing on carpet or asphalt, using rubber or foam; these are specific tuning options or chassis configurations; there is no compromise in any of the circuit scenarios; 5 cell, 6 cell or lipo - 23mm packs fit without any modifcation, unlike many other kits) Somewhere in all their testing the tolerance of the EU 6 cell configuration was not spotted. Or perhaps they were using packs put togetehr properly and felt the tight tolerance was OK? BUT to their credit, they listened to their customers and acted immediately. Within a month of this one hitting the forum, they had listened, considered, redesigned, remanufactured and distributed through the global distributon channel 2 replacement parts to all owners. Hell I got mine before I put our kit togther. That is customer service of the highest level. Unlike for example Serpent owners who who still have poo rear diffs. Well I suppose with carbon chassis, black drive shafts, black springs, black screws, black cables, black cable ties, you would acall it black? ;D |
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Post by yellowshark on Jun 27, 2008 10:19:09 GMT
This one car had been designed and engineered to suite the variations of racing on carpet or asphalt, using rubber or foam; these are specific tuning options or chassis configurations; there is no compromise in any of the circuit scenarios; 5 cell, 6 cell or lipo - 23mm packs fit without any modifcation, unlike many other kits) No hopups need here, all in the base kitHell I got mine before I put our kit togther. Our kit was pre-ordered and in the first UK shipment. |
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Post by ukcmf on Jun 27, 2008 10:58:23 GMT
Hey some of us have been at work for an hour Ah so posting at 5:36am yesterday would be classified as work then Col ;D Ummm yes ? ) |
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Post by ukcmf on Jun 27, 2008 11:00:09 GMT
Just a thought Col...Is Derek going to use the Cyclone chassis I gave him??.... Yep just collecting the parts together Col |
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Post by lesbaldry on Jun 27, 2008 12:17:55 GMT
Ok Col just a thought..Lol Pete you old trout,you rose to that one mate....Fly fishing by Mark "blue boy " Townsend.... ;D....Tell you what Pete, lets get our 008's anodised blue just to keep him happy...good engineering in a inferior colour ;D ...He' even got a speedo to match ...Tamy pants too ;D |
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Post by yellowshark on Jun 27, 2008 13:16:27 GMT
Tell you what Pete, lets get our 008's anodised blue just to keep him happy...good engineering in a inferior colour Les you have given the game away. Reuben will go out and buy an 008 now ;D |
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Post by Reuben on Jun 27, 2008 14:42:35 GMT
seriously.......... well the part that gave the game away was the super-dooper customer support, because loads of people have recomended xray because of their support. so tell me: this the one? www.mirageracing.com/piw.php?partNo=XR300011so outer the 3 then? oh and theres this one, with loads of spares, worth getting? cgi.ebay.co.uk/NEW!-XRAY-008-EU-6-CELL-VERSION-EXCLUSIVE-KIT!!-+-MORE!_W0QQitemZ290241346402QQcmdZViewItem?IMSfp=TL080626092a5261 ^you have to manually copy and paste it into address bar because proboards dont recognise it with a space |
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Post by yellowshark on Jun 27, 2008 16:04:13 GMT
Yes thats the one. That is the model you want. The US 6 cell is aimed at the American market (strangely enough!) for carpet/foam and has a number of differences, thicker chassis for one. Note that via the internet shops eg Microtech Racing (have 1 in stock) you will pay 279. The Ebay one. Well yes at 165 and 2 indoor races you can't go wrong really but I suspect it will end somewhat higher. A bit strange there is no picture of the car and if the price went well into the 200s I would want to know what the spares are. (again strange they are not listed really) EG there are two diffs in the box - are they 008 diffs or 007/T2 diffs. These will fit, with some shims (so I read) but they may not be quite as good. If they are multi diffs for the front then I would not want them having had that device on our T2; the 008 spool for the front is far superior. But look don't let me put you off; if you can save 70/80 quid that can't be bad. Obviously comes with the normal Ebay caveat emptor. I bought a 2nd hand T2 off Ebay last year, 4 or 5 indoor races and it was in pristine condition. I would post the question does it come with the Instruction Manual, T2 setup book and Xray certificate though. Tempted myself although a 3rd one would be a bit ostentateous although it would mean Dad could start driving I guess |
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>:(The quality of the kit is of the highest order, as is the build documentation, build experience and setup and tuning documentation.